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How do you fight a just cause like social justice?

You try and do what you feel is best to protect your culture and you get labelled a racist?

Like most people in this country I fear people coming into it and simply taking, welfare, benefit all in the name of political correctness and being a 'rich' nation. Overlooking all other aspects of immigration and the effect it is having on the populations feelings about their government and they way in which we are viewed by the outside world.

I hate racism, in all forms, direct or indirect, adverts for jobs in which the person must speak English, or they won't employ from inner city regions in fear they may get an ethnic minority applying for the position, I hate all of it.

But when does there come a point where pragmatism must take over? Why with all of the programs set in place by the EU and the United Nations aren't we using them to help those who most need it, instead of providing help to those who are actually better off and would be better off in their own country helping to rebuild it? We train Africa's doctors and lawyers, we train Eastern Europes business people for that purpose and then we complain? How hypocritical.

Only 2% of the people who come to this country ever claim a form of welfare, and yet why is the nation up in arms about it? Why is everyone resorting to racist terms and underhand thinking rather than debating in the open how to treat this issue? Is nobody waking up and realising that if we actually talk about it and make the proper reforms to our immigration and refugee legislation it would mean a better position for both?

But not in this country, we prefer to sit in our armchairs playing at politics in Working Mens Clubs and Public Houses congratulating ourselves on being so more intelligent than the people we vote in at every election.

Yet when one of them brings it up for debate they get torn down by the media, the very people helping this culture of fear, perhaps because they know they would lose money if the issues were raised and dealt with. But no, they get labelled as racist and the message gets lost.

I do believe we should have a system in this country that you cannot obtain benefit (in terms of immigration NOT refugee status) until you have worked and contributed for at least three years. You shouldn't be able to drive in this country until you have at least an 'A' Level or equivalent in spoken and written English.

This isn't to put manacles on people, it is too allay the fear on both sides, it would stop the British populous thinking they were being taken for a free ride, and it would help to intergrate those coming to this country rather than being left on the fringes of society.

But at the moment we seem to be going backwards and not making the investment in our own culture, helping to encourage it to become a more accepting and understanding culture. Losing the ground at the first hoop isn't helping.

------
Ask not what you can do to poetry, but what poetry can do to you.


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The following comments are for "How to Fight a Just Cause"
by londongrey

Excellent proposal
Marvelous work. This makes a lot of sense and is well-reasoned, Alex, and thus it is doomed.

"Only 2% of the people who come to this country ever claim a form of welfare, and yet why is the nation up in arms about it?" The situation is comparable in the United States and Canada, nations created by immigrants that were intended to be places where immigrants could prosper. Yet xenophobia has taken over, facts be damned.

At my university, our student population is becoming more international every year. In some departments, nearly half of the graduate students are international students, as are many of the undergrads and faculty. It's frustrating for all sides because these people come to Canada believing they know English -- they've passed a test that told them so. Yet they don't realize that the test is worthless. So they arrive at an English speaking university without knowing much English, and the situation seems hopeless. They're frustrated, their employers and colleagues are frustrated -- no one wins.

Yet the government will do nothing to improve the situation because they save money in transfer fees by minimizing the number of Canadian students.

And the universities do nothing because they're able to milk a lot more money out of international students than they could ever squeeze out of Canadians.

It is not only the academic world that faces these sorts of problems, as you make clear! Frustrating.

( Posted by: Viper9 [Member] On: May 30, 2005 )

Lilia and Viper...
Thank you for your responses!!

I have so much more time now, I may be published on my works which is so brilliant I'm almost having kittens!!!

SO thank god I might actually start to enjoy writing again.

Propoganda is such a huge issue, we only seem to view it as something historical, not realising the extent it continues today, really good point.

Thank you Viper, saying this is good really means something oh Mr. Published. Hehe, Hug

Alex xxxxx

( Posted by: londongrey [Member] On: May 30, 2005 )

Viper9 and Alex
Alex.

To give credit where it's due...yours was most definitely a well thought out and well written piece,certainly deserving of kudos.

Viper9 the point you made about students from third world countries coming to Universities in the West without knowing enough English to get by is so valid.

However it may interest you to know that even in third world countries there exist a significant number ,who are completely fluent in English, but who have never set foot in any Western country -nor have any hope of doing so .

( Posted by: RJKT [Member] On: June 8, 2005 )

Viper9 and Alex ..contd..
To continue from where i'd inadvertently left off ...my late father ,an Indian, had in 1939 got his PhD, in Plant Genetics in a space of just under 18 months...from Kings' College London and not from any dodgy hole-in-the-wall university .

Subsequently working from India he had even managed to get an article published in 1961 in 'Nature' ..which even in those days was no mean feat.

However throughout his working life ,try as he might ,he could never get even the job of a janitor at any Western University..while thousands less qualified and less competent than he ,managed to get all that he had aspired to ..and then some more.One of the ironies of life I guess.

I did 'let off some steam 'in this regard in an article i'd published here a while back.

( Posted by: RJKT [Member] On: June 8, 2005 )

RJKT
I don't doubt that at all. The world's a fucked-up place.

Getting published in "Nature" has NEVER been easy, so kudos to your dad!

My mother had a boyfriend who was in a similar situation. He had a degree in electrical engineering, and immigrated to Canada because he actually believed the immigrant propaganda that Canada and the US spread around the world. When he got here, he found that his degree wasn't recognized because it was Guatamalan. He ended up working for decades as a cabinetmaker instead.

This bullshit of not recognizing degrees from other nations is frustrating and senseless. For one thing, many of the countries whose degrees North America doesn't recognize have higher standards than we do, and those of us who actually work in academia know it. We read their work, talk to them, and covet their grad students (the ones who speak English, at least).

But governments won't listen to people who actually know what they're talking about. Only oil barons and Texan chimpanzees.

Plus, admitting that other countries have higher standards seems like admitting that our standards are low. And that isn't necessarily the case. There are lots of good schools in Canada and the US, and there are lots of good schools around the rest of the world.

I remember reading a book in which the author said, "I don't need to beat other women in order to prove that I love my wife". An insightful statement.

( Posted by: Viper9 [Member] On: June 8, 2005 )

RJKT and Labour Force
RJ you make an extremely valid point, in Britain in the two decades after WWII we had a crisis of Labour, we had more jobs than could be filled by the population, hence the influx from the old 'Empire'. From the West Indies came HMS Windrush and of course the migration from the Sub Continent was enormous, making up a hugely diverse new workforce from Bangladesh to Ceylon.

Unfortunately it took a long time for those in positions of affluence in this country to realise the true wirth of this new labour force. Your father was one of those in caught in the cross over. At that time Britain loved people like him in India, it was like a pat on the back for doing such a good job in the days of the Raj, but if they came to the UK, oh no, different matter.

I find this topic one of the most interesting.

I was watching a documentary in which all of these people from abroad thought that England was a white nation, and coming here especially to places like London or say somewhere like Bradford and Leeds, they were shocked at the diversity.

I love our little Island, history and all.

( Posted by: londongrey [Member] On: June 8, 2005 )

Viper9 and Alex
Thank you both very much for having carefully gone through my little 'rant'. I was particularly touched at both your reactions...very detailed and making extremely valid points.

Viper9 , i think that much of the credit for having set Father on the right track as far as his subsequent research work went, should go to the man who had trained him at Kings ....orginally a Canadian farm lad called Reginald Ruggles Gates ...for a brief while, the first husband of Dr. Marie Stopes.

Alex , you're absolutely right ..Dad was caught in the cross-over. I loved the second para of what you wrote ,that very neatly sums it all up.

During Dad's pre-war student days ,London was a very different place...and very far from being swamped by people from elsewhere.The few who were there from India were ,by and large, students studying at the elite Universities..London , Oxford and Cambridge. Incredible as it may sound in this day and age..among the graduate students at Kings in those days ,was a young German Lad ,a member of the Luftwaffe . I remember Dad telling me that this guy had a little plane that he kept parked at Croydon .On weekends he'd use it to hop across to Germany to visit his girlfriend ...sometimes I wish i'd been alive in those interesting times.

Strange as it may sound..I too love your 'sceptered isle'...

Cheers to you both.

( Posted by: RJKT [Member] On: June 8, 2005 )

Alex
I should be pleasantly surprised ,were you to get to see this - and perhaps reply to it.

I seem to remember your mentioning your interest in the era of Empire . I wonder if you've read Jan Morris' -earlier James Morris of the Times - tryptich on The Empire. To my mind ,no one has ever written about it better and more brilliantly than he /she.

I understand that the late Beverly Nichols -one of great writers of the last century - has also written am acclaimed book called 'Verdict on India' -though the views expressed therein my be hopelessly dated -it having been written in the late '20 s or early '30s.

Doug Soderstrom has a point about a steady , relentless dumbing down having taken place . This has certainly been the case in the creative arts -where ,if you'll excuse my saying so,standards seem to have fallen precipitously over the last 50 and odd years.

Cheers.

( Posted by: RJKT [Member] On: June 29, 2005 )





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