Obama's Kennedy Moment
by gamblerman (Member) - published: September 27, 2008
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The debate was basically a draw. But McCain lost because he had to change the game and he didn't. Obama won by NOT losing. Like Kennedy in 1960 when debating Nixon, Obama proved equal to McCain on the podium they mutually shared.

A big chunk of the American people are waiting to dump the GOP on the lamest of excuses. Now they have that excuse. Obama held his own and looked presidential. McCain looked liked yesterday's left-over meat-loaf.

Demographics have been turning against the GOP for the last decade and McCain who never had a serious chance of winning now looks pretty spent. His bag of tricks is empty.

Obama won the presidency when he defeated Hillary after Super Tuesday earlier this winter. Now the long march is nearing its end. but Obama will inherit a government and an economy that has been basically gutted.

Could this have been prevented?

Possibly.

I was watching an old clip on YOU TUBE of the 2000 presidential debate and cringed as Al Gore repeatedly made a fool of himself with his erratic behavior. Bush looked presidential compared to Al Gore. But barely....and that's not saying much.

Had Al Gore run a campaign just one fifth as good as Obama did this year there would have been no chance at all for Bush to steal the election eight years ago.

Al Gore is no fool. I met him in 1982 at a futurist conference in DC when I was a student at UC Berkeley and he was just an unknown congressman. Al Core was a visionary then, he still is one now. But he will always be a lousy campaigner and American politics rarely ever rewards losers. Even when it rewards crooks on a regular basis.

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Comments

The following comments are for "Obama's Kennedy Moment"
by gamblerman

Used Camel Lot
Well said.

Upon reading your title I feared Obama had driven off a bridge, or into a concrete barrier on his way to cast a Senate vote at 3:00 AM. Different Kennedy.

Gore's Secret Service codename was "Sawhorse". He's somewhat more animated recently. I won't say Gore is xyloid (resembling wood- my new vocabulary word of the day, thanks to Reader's Digest), but it's been said that his nose grows when he lies. If true, it would have to be bigger than it is, given his career choice.

( Posted by: drsoos [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Think So? I HOPE So!--Michael and DrSoos too..heeheeheehehee!!!
Hi Michael,

I so hope you are right about this, you are usually are right on the political analysis, so I am quite excited you feel this way...because I was feeling a bit down and unsure of that whole debate as to who came out ahead, especially sense McCain was being less intellectually and appealing to the majority voter (the good old boys and gals that are brainwashed Pavlov dogs when it comes to responding to the bells and whistle tricks of the Republican trickery in slogan speech talk and repetitiveness of nonsense and outright lies--such as what McCain did at the debate)....so, to me my fear was that Obama came off too intelligent and the typical voter doesn't get "intelligent" nor does the typical voter DIG for the truth. So I felt Obama should have responded MUCH more strongly than he did everytime McCain said some of his bullshit outright lies about Obama's record this and that and how Obama "didn't understand", etc.,---Obama should have blasted McCain with Obama's famous quick diss come backs...playing dirty right back but he didn't. That disappointed me. So, my husband heard the debate on the radio and he said on the radio it seemed McCain came out ahead verbally, but yeah, you gotta consider that what won the campaign for Kennedy against Nixon back in the 60s was TV---on TV Obama will always come out ahead, he looks good, he looks presidential. McCain looks like a corpse. I remember that during the 60s Kennedy/Nixon debate I was a little kid, a real little kid since I was born in the middle 50s, and I remember looking at the black and white TV and thinking this very clearing: "oh that man is so ugly and scary looking so creepy"...of course I was looking at Nixon. I liked the Kennedy man, he looked 'Nice' and I liked him because he had a nice smile and his face wasn't scary. That was a kid's perspective and reaction without understanding a thing about what was going on, going purely on human psychological response to how we as humans are more drawn to the better looking people.

Obama is definitely better looking than McCain and I think that Americans, grown up or not will respond from that basic human instinct of picking and feeling better about the guy that "looks" right. Obama looks right. McCain looks like a creepy old dead man. So on some unconscious level the TV thing make be a HUGE deciding factor as to who gets the last and most votes, just as what happened when TV was introduced into the whole political debating arena in the 60s.

By the way, Michael, meet DrSoos, I have alway been a huge fan of DrSoos, he is intelligent and has really quick wit and the ability to come up with really great satire material, particularly political satire. When I read his comment I laughed so hard, too funny.

Again, hope you are right for all the reasons you stated and I hope I knowing a little about the basic unconscious responses that the normal less uneducated guy and gal in middle America or on any American street will respond from their more cave man id brain and pick Obama because he looks like a leader, he is the ONE to lead the tribe...not that old man on his last leg, he should be put out on an iceberg and left to drift....bye bye McCain, die well.

Thanks for your insights again, Michael.

OBAMA/BIDEN 08

( Posted by: TheRealKarmaTseringLhamo [Admin] On: September 28, 2008 )

Yup
Obama was playing it safe the first debate. He simply cannot afford to look or sound like an angry black brother....it's over. Obama has won. It might be tight in the electoral college, but it's over.

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Nice
I found this today on TPM where I usually blog about politics. Pretty right on....

I was 8 in 1960 and that was the first election I remember as my folks were huge JFK fans. My son saw Obama with me in May in Hickory NC and puts up with Dad the political junkie.

Last night Andrew asked me what a debate was and I told him it was like a boxing match with words. He thought that sounded pretty cool so we watched the debate.

I explained the scoring boxes on CNN and I asked him to simply give me his reactions so we would watch a segment, pause the DVR, talk for a minute and go back to the "Thrilla at Ole Miss".

He enjoyed the "fight" and I must say out of the mouths of babes come some pretty good analysis. As you might expect much of his reactions were visceral which is a huge part of how many people will react:

* "Why is McCain so mad?"
* "Why is he so old like Grammy?
* "Daddy, when McCain smiles like that ( ie-the smirk) I think he is really mad at Obama".
* "I don't like it when he acts like that."
* "Why isn't he looking at Obama? Barack looks at him. I think he is trying to be mean."
* "Obama looks better"
* "When McCain talks it bores me and when Obama talks it excites me."

I think that Andrew's observations are pretty astute and sum up how a lot of people will remember last night. In fact looking at Frank Luntz' NV focus group of independent voters looks like my son was spot on how they felt and 17/27 of them - 62% - thought Obama won....just the group we need to convince.

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

I hope Andrew is Right !
Andrew made very insightful observations.

McCain sounds boring and even bored ! He really has nothing much to say. This is another president who will tell us how the world is complicated that our common sense does not work. Well, hell, no. The world is complicated because we have dumb politicians who manage to create a mess of any straight forward situation.

We need a new breed of politicians who can have the courage to go back to basics. If the Ozone layer problem will cause our cities to drown, then we do something about it. If our foreign policy sucks, then we should hire someone who knows the difference between Slovakia and Slovania and listen to what they had to say about the real reasons behind terrorism and how we can fight that illusive war.

I am not sure if Obama has enough of that material. I am not the American people are ready for that kind of politics. But I am damn sure as hell that the GOP has none of that material anywhere in its headquarters, nor even hidden in the basement or the archive rooms. They do not have "it", never had "it", will never have "it" period. They are just too blinded by rich corporates to see things in clear perspective.

( Posted by: waelnawara [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Obama/Biden 08
Well said everyone, and like waelnawara has said I too hope Andrew is right, because just like I said in my comments earlier on this sight I had the same reaction as a child watching the Kennedy/Nixon debates. From the mouths of babes, from the instincts of our ids/souls...we know who is good and who is not.

Question: Why would a BILLIONAIRE who is 72 years old, white as snow, and can just enjoy life and the rest of his short life, want to take on a job that will surely KILL him while in office? Sounds like EGO motives to me? Some just can't get enough. Now Obama came from a struggling family background of mixed heritage, understanding, tolerance, working class folk and became an altruistic minded attorney for most of his working life..his wife too, also altruistic life, made it up from nothing and struggled and they are both, Obama, his family fresh, young and idealistic with the motivation for TRUTH and REAL CHANGE, that makes more sense to me. Obama is running on truth for altruistic public service reasons, and a service to the world I do believe, for the world will see at last that not all our presidents are a copy of pasty white faced corporate CEO exploitative "we are better than the rest of the world" attitude types. Obama represents CHANGE in so many good ways, and he makes total sense for America and the world in general. Now back to that question of McCain? Why isn't that BILLIONIARE 72 year old vacationing in the Bahamas somewhere? Does he really want to leave us in the hands of Sarah Palin the sociopathic nut job who holds guns and babies at the same time as her idea of a "normal family life?" photo album pic, eh? She will blow up the world, she will continue the elitist American attitude that we are somehow superior to the rest of the world's nations, etc., she is just the worst possible thing that could happen to American, worse than it has ever been....she is a living lipstick wearing beast nightmare for all! G-d save us from that beast. For McCain surely will die in office, without a doubt I know this and she will take over and then the world will go BOOM!

OK, enough political rant and excitement for one night for me...time for a relaxing video game.
Thanks again for you thought provoking pieces and insights.

Namaste,
friend in dharma,
'Lena'
Karma Tsering Lhamo

PS. Michael, I have been studying all those things you linked me too, so much to learn, thanks again, friend. Be well. Blessings;-)

( Posted by: TheRealKarmaTseringLhamo [Admin] On: September 28, 2008 )

Don't forget....
Palin believes Dnosaurs and man walked together on aerth 6000 years ago....Oh, I forgot. McCain picked her because she's a maverick. Silly me!

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Dinosaurs 6,000 years ago
Sure ... that was no mistake ...she is sending a Biblical message ... that she really believes that the world was created 5,508 Years B.C., just as the good old testament says, by adding the age of Noah 950 years to all the nice folks who enjoyed a longevity never seen again or before on planet earth!

That was no mistake or a slip ... it is an intended message of belief, to please the religious right ...

I could be wrong of course ... but ... hey ... they are not naiive :)

( Posted by: waelnawara [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Oh, and....
This fresh from the London Times...

In an election campaign notable for its surprises, Sarah Palin, the Republican vice- presidential candidate, may be about to spring a new one -- the wedding of her pregnant teenage daughter to her ice-hockey-playing fianc� before the November 4 election.

Inside John McCain's campaign the expectation is growing that there will be a popularity boosting pre-election wedding in Alaska between Bristol Palin, 17, and Levi Johnston, 18, her schoolmate and father of her baby. "It would be fantastic," said a McCain insider. "You would have every TV camera there. The entire country would be watching. It would shut down the race for a week."

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

A Wedding is better than a Terrorist Attack
These people have no shame and will use everything possible to grab the media which had a definite crush on Obama for month and a certain yawning dislike for McCain for his lack of spirit.

I remeber, a couple of months ago, when McCain adviser said terrorist attack would boost campaign!

""
Charlie Black, a senior adviser to the US presidential hopeful John McCain has apologised after saying a terrorist attack on American soil would be a "big advantage" to the Republican candidate's election campaign.
""

So, I would say, let them have the Cameras for that wedding ... otherwise they, or some of their lunie supporters may be tempted to stage some terrorist attack "wag-the-dog-style" just to win the campiagn

:)

( Posted by: waelnawara [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

so...
It's the avenging gunslinger from Arizona versus the protean basketball player from G-d knows where he came from....

America is struggling to embrace a new kind of archetype....

....America is looking for its new soul....

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Polls Show Obama won the Debate with a slender victory
CBS Insta Poll shows Barack Obama won 39% to John McCain's 25% with 36% saying the debate was a draw.

Insider Advantage reports of those polled Obama won 42% to McCain's 41% with Undecided 17%

CNN reports voter opinions that Obama "did better" 51%, McCain "did better" 38% - CNN poll showed men were evenly split, but women gave Obama higher marks 59% to 41% for McCain.

CNN poll reported a slight bias in the survey to the Democrats. However, there are more Democrats in the country (USA). So that more Democrats watched. It can also make proposals for the Democratic enthusiasm that will help the vote.

On MSNBC on-line (non-scientific) research showed Obama winning the debate 52% to 33%. (But that is what one would expect from a similar survey in MSNBC because of the nature of its audience.)

Body Language
************

McCain never once looked at Obama during the debate. If you can't look your opponent in the eye there's something wrong. It made him look both weak and condescending.

( Posted by: waelnawara [Member] On: September 28, 2008 )

Millenium Media Meme Mutates

The difference between Nixon and Kennedy was between radio and TV in their 1960 presidential debate. Those listening to the radio mostly thought Nixon got the upper hand on Kennedy. TV viewers saw Nixon sweating like a pig bound for slaughter while Kennedy was cool and collected.

McCain is the 21st century Nixon, "don't know much about the economy, let's escalate in Vietnam or Afghanistan- close enough. I owe them a great death."

Obama uses e-mail quite effectively.

McCain has a girl for that.

It's time for real change,

Obama/ Biden '08

s

( Posted by: drsoos [Member] On: September 29, 2008 )

well....

I predicted a narrow win for Obama, but after this week it's starting to look like a route....the beginning of the end at last. Bye, bye maverick and MILF.

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 29, 2008 )

pleased to meet you.. WOO! WOO! need of some restraint
I like what you did here, Michael.
The pleasure is mine. Thanks Lena.

s

( Posted by: drsoos [Member] On: September 29, 2008 )

Hum...

I'm a bit off the bell curve....

Thanks.

M

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: September 29, 2008 )

gamblerman
"Don't forget....
Palin believes Dinosaurs and man walked together on earth 6000 years ago...."

This is just one of those things that will just not let me go, and if you don't mind I would like to shed some light on this belief, where it comes from.
Of course it all begins with scripture. And we can even leave out the "God created all of life on earth in six days thing". By that I mean we do not have to fight the battle of whether is was literally six days of not, because other scripture sheds its' light on the subject also.
And that is this "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin..." -Romans 5:12.
It is clearly taught in the Bible that death entered the world ONLY after Adams sin.
It is also clearly taught that ALL of creation was affected by this fall, "For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now."-Romans 8:22.
And so my point is, that since death was not known in this world (even all animal and plant life) until Adam sinned, then man and dinosaur most certainly co-existed. I myself don't get the jaw dropping incredulity this brings to people.
We have just been so brainwashed since we were children in our public schools I guess.
And so, there is how our belief is come to us. "Let God be true, and every man a liar"-Romans 3:4
And I know most of you will never accept such ridiculous "blind faith" as this, but let me ask you something, on what side is science? True science, knowledge.
Show me your transitional fossils. I repeat, show me your transitional fossils. Show me ONE not suspect or proven false.
They should be scattered upon EVERY hill, in EVERY field, they should be as common as rock.
If animal life is millions and millions of years old, and takes millions of years to evolve, then there should be a fossilized trail of these slow transitions everywhere.
Well, like I said, I try not to speak on these matters much in these threads because they just lead to unprovable arguments, but for some reason this one has been on my mind since I read it when you first posted it, and thought that at the least, I would explain where our beliefs come from, that being, there was no death in the world until Adam sinned.
Thanks, Robert.

( Posted by: robnjop [Member] On: October 4, 2008 )

Anyway Eric
back to my point about "transitional" fossils. Know of any?

( Posted by: robnjop [Member] On: October 4, 2008 )

And also Eric
you might want to not worry so much about what we do over here, and at least put up a show of resistance toward the Muslim wolves devouring your own land.
And I of course mean that with all kindness.
Robert.

( Posted by: robnjop [Member] On: October 4, 2008 )

Sigh....
M

( Posted by: gamblerman [Member] On: October 22, 2008 )

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